Runway Podcast: Adam Jennings on the foundations of branding

Runway Podcast

In our latest podcast episode, we had the pleasure of interviewing Adam Jennings, the founder of the renowned design studio Made by Contour. Adam is a true branding expert, known for his exceptional work in creating compelling brand identities and websites. One of his notable projects includes the branding and website design for Black Unicorn PR, which has garnered attention for its distinctive and highly admired logo—so much so that it has been ‘borrowed’ multiple times by other companies.

During our conversation, Adam shared valuable insights into the world of branding, discussing everything from foundational elements to the latest trends and tools in the industry. Whether you’re building your company’s brand for the first time, considering an upgrade or evolution, or simply seeking a branding refresher, this episode promises to make all things branding clearer and more actionable.

Join us as we catch up with Adam Jennings and delve into the art and science of creating brands that stand out and resonate. For those who want to speed-read instead, you can find a full transcript below.

Julija Jegorova: Hi, everyone. Today we have a very special guest, the man behind black unicorn PR brands, someone that has been with us since day one, my favorite designer, Adam Jennings. Hi, Adam.

Adam Jennings: Hey, JJ, thanks for having me.

Julija Jegorova: Very good to have you here. So Adam, before we dive deep into the world of branding, do tell us a little bit about yourself, how come you ended up in this world?

Adam Jennings: My name is Adam, and I am a brand designer. Ever since I could draw, I’ve been creative, dabbling in art, design, photography, technical drawing, and more as I grew up. I went through university, studying digital media production, which involved learning about design, coding websites, animation, and video production.

I was fortunate to jump straight into a job as a graphic designer specializing in branding. I progressed through several companies but eventually fell out of love with the one I was working at because their goals for building brands didn’t align with mine. This led me to start freelancing. Now, I run a studio with a handful of freelancers who work with me on branding and web projects. It’s incredibly fun, and I really love it.

I’ve been able to work from all over the world because I can work remotely, collaborating with some amazing brands. This includes everything from day-one startups to established teams with 40 to 60 members, managing the entire branding process in between. It’s been an exciting journey, and I feel very fortunate to be having this conversation.

Many people start out in design but have to give it up or fall out of love with it for various reasons. For me, it’s my absolute passion. Even if I won the lottery, I’d still be a designer. I’d just be more selective about who I could help, focusing on those who need it but might not have the budget for it. So, that’s a bit of background on me—I’m a very passionate designer.

Julija Jegorova: So Adam, let’s talk about branding, design, and startups. Quite frequently, I think, when we started working together—and we’ve been working together for six years now—we tend to hear that people think about the brand at the very end. You know, the brand is usually an afterthought, or people think a brand is just a logo that you need to put out.

Adam Jennings: Not so. Everyone is working on creating something they really care about. If you’re not thinking about how to put that in front of your audience, how to speak to your audience, and how to stay vulnerable, you’re going to get caught out really quickly. The brands that show up and that you connect with are the ones that succeed and stay head and shoulders above everyone else. If you prioritize building a brand story and connecting in a way that’s more than just a transaction—where it’s not just an exchange of money—you’ll go far ahead of your competition.

If you get it right, the brand builds itself and maintains that trajectory as your business grows. It informs what you do as a business, assuming you’ve set your brand up to respond to what your audience is asking for. It’s a fun space if you let it play out, provided you have those foundations in place. So, if you think about branding as a goal from the start, it makes life a lot easier.

Julija Jegorova: So, if you are, let’s say, a startup in the early stages, when does it make sense to start thinking about the brand? Is it when you’re at the MVP stage, right away, or at a later stage?

Adam Jennings: For me, it’s as early as possible. It’s important to differentiate that your logo is not your brand—they’re two separate things. You can establish your brand’s look and feel, your tone of voice, and your foundations without needing a logo. People don’t buy from you because you have a logo; they buy from you because they care about what you’re doing, whether you’re selling something, sharing an idea, or bringing them along on a journey you’re curating.

You don’t need to have a polished visual identity on day one, but having the elements that underpin your brand—like your values, mission, and the things that give you personality—should be in place as early as possible. It’s hard when you’re starting up for the first time because you might not know what these are yet. However, the sooner you have those conversations, the quicker you’ll have a consistent style or tone that the world can recognize and understand what you’re about.

Julija Jegorova: So, when people think about brands, the first thing and often the only thing they think about is a logo and maybe colors. But it’s not just that, is it? There’s a lot more that goes into it, right?

Adam Jennings: Of course. Anyone can design a logo or pick colors—that’s the easy part. But the real challenge is asking how these elements tell your story and build something bigger than just an individual or a business. The story behind it and the reasons for using certain colors, types, and other visual elements in specific ways are crucial. Underpinning that with foundations like your values, mission statement, and brand statement—these are the elements that truly connect and communicate what you’re about to your audience. It’s about more than just one visual asset. It’s a number of interconnected pieces that work together to build your visual identity. You can address them all separately, but they only truly work when you think about them together as an entire brand.

Mauro Battellini: What is branding to you, and what is your process?

Adam Jennings: Whoa, that is a brilliant and challenging question. Branding is the culmination of all the things that define you as a business. When done right, it should serve as a transparent communication tool between you and your audience. It encompasses the story you tell, the tone of voice that connects your messaging, and the visual assets that represent you and engage your audience. Your branding should be consistently foundational across all platforms—whether in person, digitally, or in print. Done right, it uses various deliverables to build out your brand story.

For me, the process starts with caring deeply about the brand and the business I’m working with. This gives a huge advantage. I prioritize understanding what the business is trying to achieve. For example, I don’t just want to work with an import business that churns out products to consumers, even though there’s nothing wrong with that business model. Instead, I look for businesses that I care about, often those trying to do something different or those with a people- or planet-focused mission—businesses trying to leave the planet a better place.

From that point, it’s all about asking lots of questions. We start with a discovery session to understand why the company exists, what makes them special, what their audience is looking for, and what their competitors are doing. This gives us a position to make informed choices. The difference for me between design and art is that while art can exist purely because you like it, design should be intentional. We gather as much research and data as possible to inform the next stages of the process.

Then, we move into exploration, which might include styles, concepts, tone of voice, visual cues, logo design—basically creating a testbed for exploration. There’s no right or wrong at this stage; it’s about imagining what the brand could look like when everything comes together and how it tells the story. Once we’ve defined the story, we bring in visuals to help tell it.

After that, it’s about developing the brand in collaboration with the client. We consider how it looks as a whole and build out foundational elements to ensure cohesion and translatability across different platforms. Finally, we deploy the brand and enjoy seeing it in the wild.

Julija Jegorova: How long does the process usually take? What would you say the length of the whole process is typically

Adam Jennings: Our branding process typically takes about six to eight weeks. The reason for this is that we work through a timeline, but sometimes you need to play with an idea. If I set a deadline to finish something by Friday, but we’re forcing it, we might need that extra bit of space. Equally, if the client needs more time to think about their opinion of something or explore a concept and let it sit with them, sometimes that takes a couple of extra days. And that’s absolutely fine.

I don’t think it’s right to force the process because interpreting ideas can sometimes take a little time to settle. So, I usually build out a two-month timeline for our branding projects. Sometimes it can be quicker, and sometimes it can take a bit longer. But it’s not something to rush because if you’re going to invest appropriately, it’s something you want to get right, and that sometimes takes time.

Mauro Battellini: Putting ourselves in the shoes of a startup founder, for example, what would you recommend they start with? What are the first considerations and the most important assets?

Adam Jennings: Great question. For me, the only visual priority at the start is trying to define a color that represents you. By that, I mean picking something that you can use consistently across any content you create, so people can start to recognize and associate it with you. It doesn’t have to be unique or groundbreaking, just something that you can consistently use as a visual cue.

Once you’ve got that, the most important thing is to have some kind of story, easily broken down into a positioning statement about what you do and who you serve. For example, I might say, “I’m a design studio that helps startups launch their brands into the market.” This statement clarifies what you do, who you do it for, and the impact you aim to have. It helps you communicate clearly with your audience about the services you offer and gives you the confidence to say, “This is what we are, and this is what we do.”

Having a clear positioning statement sets you apart from many companies that just claim to offer a generic service. People care about what you do differently, who you serve, and what makes you special. Communicating this effectively will inform your vision for the business, the work you’re currently doing, and the change you want to see in the world. If you can nail these foundational elements, you’ll have enough of a story to start growing in front of your audience. So, for me, it’s all about the positioning statement and color as the absolute bare minimum. Even a work-in-progress version of these will give you a significant advantage over simply showing up and offering a generic service.

Mauro Battellini: In considering the choices for branding, what are the most important factors? Obviously, industry, products, marketing, and target customers are really important. For example, in FinTech or finance, companies tend to favor the color blue. What do you see as the most important dimensions or aspects to consider?

Adam Jennings: I think it depends on what type of business you are. For example, as you mentioned, finance generally favors blue, and that’s fine. There are two angles to this: if you want to be safe and build off the existing industry credentials, blue is a safe and appropriate color. But if you want to stand out, you need to recognize that blue is the primary color for that market and ask, “What can I do to challenge that?”

Looking at a color wheel, the opposite of blue is usually some shade of orange. Take Monzo, for example. When they entered the market, they launched a bright coral orange card, which was trend-driven and a complete polar opposite to the industry’s standard. If you want to stand out, you need to look at what the industry is currently doing, understand why they are doing it, and then figure out how to challenge that.

It’s not always about following trends, nor is it about ignoring them. Sometimes, making informed choices based on trends will set you apart. There’s a famous saying, “When everyone zigs, zag.” Trends provide insight into what the market is doing and can inform your decisions. However, that doesn’t mean you have to follow them; you can choose to go in a different direction if that makes sense for your brand.

For me, it’s about knowing what type of business you are and whether you want to play it safe. New businesses, brands, and products often launch because they see a problem they want to solve. I don’t believe that solving the problem means sitting in a stereotypical space. Just because something has always been done a certain way doesn’t mean you should continue doing it that way.

Understand what you’re trying to achieve, why it hasn’t been done before, and build your story around how you can communicate that. Everything, from the font and color to all the brand assets, should tell the same story. Monzo, for instance, was a challenger in the FinTech community, and their whole brand identity, not just one color choice, reflected that.

No matter what your business does, know what you’re trying to do, what you’re challenging, and what change you want to create. This comes down to your vision for how you see the world changing because of your existence. Lean into that and create your entire story to support that vision. I think it’s exciting to challenge what others are doing.

Mauro Battellini: And you remind me of a few brands that are doing that. Over in the US, you’ve probably heard of Liquid Death—brands that are doing kind of irreverent marketing and taking branding to a whole new place. So, yeah, I wanted to ask you what you think of those brands, and also what you’re seeing currently in the world of branding?

Adam Jennings: Great question. Brands like Liquid Death are phenomenal. They are absolutely audience and customer-driven, making choices based on what’s happening in the market. Traditionally, businesses have been very much about dictating their message: “We tell you, we show up, we do this thing, and that’s what you get.” Some of the new brands, however, are much quicker to act, responding to situations and bringing out new options. The advertising world has always been good at leaning into that.

I love the movement of challenging the status quo, almost sticking the middle finger up at what used to be and presenting a new way. Gen Z, in particular, is driving this, willing to ask “why” and challenge established norms. With social media making everything instantly visible, brands can respond quickly to issues, making their responses exciting and fun. If your brand foundations are solid, you can stay on brand even while reacting to something unexpected.

For example, there was a billboard taken down in the US featuring a pregnant woman, which was deemed inappropriate by some. I think it was Kellogg’s that responded by featuring that woman in a campaign or on a cereal box. Brands can now be so responsive, and when their reactions are on brand, it reinforces their foundational values and attracts people who align with them.

People look to align themselves with brands that represent them, almost forming an extension of their identity. The best brands focus on their customers as brand ambassadors rather than just an audience. When someone buys your product, they become a brand ambassador, spreading the word. Referrals are a powerful way to grow a business, and if a million people believe in your brand and tell their friends about it, that’s incredibly powerful.

Creating products, businesses, and brands that people want to share with their friends is a massive win. The brands that do this well stand for something, show up authentically, and stay true to their values. They create a community of like-minded people who champion their cause. Brands like Liquid Death have challenged their industry in a fun and exciting way, which works well for them. Not every brand needs to be fun, but for those that it fits, it’s exciting to follow along. Liquid Death has done an amazing job, and it’s really great to see.

Julija Jegorova: Which brings me to the question, what are your favorite brands? Maybe the top three that you think have done an absolutely amazing job in the past couple of years?

Adam Jennings: Such a good question. A lot of the brands I admire have existed for a long time, and it’s their long-standing foundations that I admire. Nike is an easy one for me. They’ve always shown up for their athletes and have a strong story. At least in the UK, a huge proportion of people can quote their tagline and identify them from a lineup of other sports brands. For me, Nike is incredible on that front. While their products might not be my personal favorite—annoyingly, their shoes don’t fit me well—as a brand, they are truly admirable.

I don’t want to sound too cliched, but Patagonia and Finisterre are two other brands I highly respect. They challenge our approach to consumerism, are very transparent about what they’re trying to do, and they bring you along for the ride with brilliant storytelling. They create a space where you align yourself with their mission and their focus on the planet. They connect with me personally because they do things that I admire and want to be a part of. If I’m going to consume, I want to consume something that aligns with that space.

It’s all about storytelling for me. I admire brands that tell a good story. There’s a company in Wales called Hiut Denim Co. that I find genius. They produce jeans in a town that used to be a hub for jean production before the factory closed and many people lost their jobs. Hiut Denim is trying to bring that town back to life. Their products aren’t the cheapest, and there’s a long waitlist to get them, but they are fantastic. They connect you with their story and why they matter. The people who make the jeans, called grandmasters, sign every pair. So, you end up with a pair of jeans with a signature inside. This kind of storytelling behind a good product is incredibly inspiring.

If you’re able to connect with people and tell them why you matter, why you exist, and why they should care, it’s so powerful. We’re being pulled in a million directions by every Instagram, TikTok, and Twitter feed saying, “Look at me, look at me.” I feel drawn to brands that I want to look at because they tell me something I care about. I’m heavily motivated by morals, by businesses that are trying to do good and create change in the world, challenging the norm. Finding brands that do that is incredibly inspiring to me.

Even if their product isn’t something I personally use, if their communication style and the things they create are fun and interesting, I want to follow along. The lowest entry point to caring about a brand is a follow or a like. Brands that recognize this path understand that once someone follows them on social media or signs up for an email list, they’ve made that smallest commitment. From that point, all the brand has to do is support them, providing value and insights that are relevant. The brands that master this grow significantly. You don’t have to sign up customers for your biggest package or best product immediately. The single easiest win is just saying, “Hey, we’re here, look at me.” If you can get someone to care enough to follow you or interact with you, that’s the zero-to-one step. Once they’re following and invested, you can map out the trajectory to purchasing or engaging in your service or product.

So, my top brands are Nike, Finisterre and Patagonia (kind of twinned), and Hiut Denim Co. Their storytelling and commitment to their values make them stand out to me.

Mauro Battellini: To take it back a little bit to our new startup founder or marketing person who just joined the startup, and they’ve been given the role of CMO for the first time. What would your advice be to them in terms of thinking about branding, especially in a time when everyone’s really focused on performance marketing, achieving clicks, conversions, etc.? It feels like for many, branding is something you do at the beginning, and if you grow sufficiently, you do a brand refresh. But from what you’re saying, it’s obviously a lot more in the DNA of a company. It’s difficult to understand where branding ends.

Adam Jennings: Yeah, absolutely. If you’re joining a company and there’s not a clear brand in place, the first thing I’d do is ask lots of questions. This applies both within the company—to understand the culture, what makes the company special, why people joined, what matters—and externally with the audience. Put out surveys and absorb as much as you can about the brand. The brand perception externally might not align with the ideals of the brand, and there may be a disconnect.

Brands should be fluid. Just like a website that you launch and leave to die if not maintained, a brand needs continuous nurturing, adjusting, and learning from interactions. You need to check in with your audience about what they’re engaging with and why those things matter to them. Brands aren’t dictatorships; there’s immense value in having conversations with your audience. You’ll learn a lot about your brand by asking these questions. While you can assertively say, “This is what we are,” it’s equally important to listen and adapt.

If there’s an established company, immerse yourself in that space to understand it fully. If you assume too much in any new role, especially as a CMO, you might get caught out quickly. The brand will evolve and change, but if set up correctly, its foundations will remain intact. These foundations—your values, what you will and won’t stand for, your position, who you serve—can be tweaked but rarely change dramatically.

One of the most valuable exercises I’ve found is writing a brand manifesto. When working with new businesses, we write a manifesto about what they stand for, what they care about, and what’s important to them. This can be anything from niche statements to broader company values. By setting up to 10 manifesto points, you create a strong foundation that the business can rally behind. This gives you guiding principles to check against for alignment with campaigns and business decisions.

You don’t have to know the exact destination, but being directionally correct is key. Knowing what your brand stands for and where it’s heading simplifies business decisions. When done right, branding guides and directs business decisions, making it a cost-effective and time-saving tool.

I’m not suggesting changing your logo every few years, but your brand should adapt and change based on market needs. The only way to know what’s happening in the market and with your audience is through conversations. Run events, have dialogues, do questionnaires, and show up where your ideal market hangs out. You’ll uncover insights you didn’t know existed.

When discussing competitors, remember no one is you. Even someone with the same education and running a similar agency will show up differently if they’re serving their audience correctly. Having those conversations provides insights that inform the trajectory of your business, giving you focus, clarity, and confidence to show up consistently.

With solid foundations and a clear brand identity, marketing campaigns can support your brand’s message with specific objectives in mind. Over time, you’ll identify gaps in your brand toolkit, adding new elements as needed. This results in a living brand that adapts and evolves with the market.

A simple example is Google’s homepage. Their changing graphic remains on-brand while being trend-oriented or date-specific, engaging people by being different and interesting. This approach has turned “Google” into a verb. Consistency in showing up everywhere in your business will help you grow as a brand. Insights into your foundations will underpin every decision, making the process truly enjoyable.

Mauro Battellini: So branding is always a consideration. Even if in the subconscious. You’re always working on the brand.

Adam Jennings: It’ll always grow as well. Like it’ll always be changing.

Mauro Battellini: At what stage does the company need to start thinking about brand in that kind of direct, serious way? or maybe what kind of company?

Adam Jennings: You know, it’s an interesting question because there are a number of variables that would inform my perspective. From my experience, if you have multiple people working on your brand—let’s say five or more, whether they are creating assets, writing content, purchasing, or involved in any activity that is informed by brand clarity—this is when you need a brand manager.

A brand manager’s role is to oversee how the brand is translated across all sectors, not just focusing on a specific area like print. They ensure that everything aligns with the brand’s identity. Whether you’re B2B or B2C, you still have a brand, and as far as I’m concerned, there’s always a customer. While the pathway to reach them might be different, you’re still selling to someone, and the way you present yourself to that person or business needs to be curated.

It doesn’t matter who you’re talking to; if there are multiple touchpoints, a brand manager can pull everything together. Without one, things can get messy quickly, as people bring their own influences and experiences into their decisions regarding the deployment of different sectors. A brand manager acts as the single source of truth, ensuring consistency. They can approve or suggest adjustments to keep everything in line with the brand.

So, for me, it’s not specifically about the type of company, but more about the team size. If you have enough people working on various aspects of your brand, and there’s a risk of the brand getting diluted, then a brand manager becomes essential. This applies to any company size as long as multiple people are involved in brand-related activities.

Mauro Battellini: What are your thoughts on generative AI and tools like Midjourney? Other Gen AI tools can generate quick logos and various visual assets. How do you think this will impact the branding world?

Adam Jennings: I think it’s really exciting. I’d be lying if I said it hasn’t scared me at times because these tools can produce quick turnarounds on deliverables. From my experience, and I’ve leaned heavily into it, exploring tools like Midjourney and Firefly, they are really exciting but none of them deliver a finished brand. They can generate cool ideas and interesting visuals, but I’ve not seen anything completely on point that couldn’t be improved by better research or better inputs.

Anyone can design a logo; that’s not hard. But a logo should represent more than just being a flag for your business. It should help tell your story and build your brand message. Currently, AI poses more of a challenge to the art world than the design world. However, it’s a tool that will keep improving and becoming more interesting. Everyone should have an awareness of it. If you’re working with an agency or a designer, AI can help visualize ideas, but it’s definitely not a finished solution.

AI is fed by the content it consumes, so if all your competitors turn to AI, they’ll produce similar content with a similar look and feel. This homogenization will make truly unique and exciting brands stand out even more. The quicker that happens, the more the creative and engaging brands will shine. There’s a limit to how far a computer can take brand development. It’s clever and amazing, but it’s not the same as being immersed in your audience and understanding what your brand stands for.

If you want a cheap logo, AI can provide that. But if you want to really connect with your audience, every single asset for your brand needs to support your foundational brand story. That’s where the magic happens, and I haven’t seen that spark come from AI yet. People still buy from and connect with people, and brands connect with people. You can’t achieve that if it’s completely handed off to a digital platform or entity.

This situation poses an interesting challenge to designers: how will you show up for your clients and deliver things that exceed what a generative tool can create? It’s exciting to be challenged, to grow, and to push boundaries. AI is not a finished solution, but it adds a new dimension and makes things exciting. New tools are fun to play with, understand their limitations, and push against them. That’s where creativity lies.

Julija Jegorova: How often should brands, in general, big or small, update their brand, the logos, the colors?

Adam Jennings: Yeah, I think it depends on the objectives. If it’s purely trend-led, I would consider it a brand extension or an evolution. For example, adapting your brand for a short-term trend, like interacting with Pokémon, can be fun and exciting but is a separate conversation. If you’re looking at evolving your brand or a complete rebrand, you need to understand why you’re doing it and what purpose it will serve.

Take the example of Every, a delivery distribution service in the UK that was formerly Hermes. Hermes had a terrible customer service rating, which was a key reason for their rebrand. Although the new branding was appealing, it didn’t fix their customer service issues. So, if your rebrand is meant to address a business change, ensure it goes beyond just a superficial update. A new logo won’t solve underlying issues.

A brand lift or evolution can be a cost-effective way to refresh your brand. You might introduce a new font, style, or graphic without starting from scratch. Sometimes, what you were using before might be limited by the tools available at the time, and there are now more exciting ways to deliver your identity. An evolution or refresh can bring newness to your business without reinventing your visual identity.

Whatever happens, when updating the brand, review your foundations to ensure they’re still appropriate for what you’re building. Business changes might require adjustments. Once you’ve established these foundations, they provide a wealth of content to communicate to your audience, explaining any updates and what you stand for now.

Updating your brand doesn’t have to be a massive change. It could be a simple update to bring things up to date and deliver something new to the market. Ensuring that the essence of the brand stays true while introducing new elements can keep things exciting and relevant. It not only delivers on your brand message but also provides new content and assets to tell your story better.

Ultimately, it always goes back to understanding why you’re making the change and ensuring you do it in a way that honors the brand.

Julija Jegorova: Okay, awesome. I think you have all the questions answered. Mauro, what about you?

Mauro Battellini: Yeah, it’s been absolutely fantastic. Adam, thanks for taking us on this journey through the world of branding. How can people find out more about you about your services? And how can they follow you?

Adam Jennings: So, I’m most active on LinkedIn. So you can find me and Adam Jennings on LinkedIn. And then most of our content is shared on our website, which is madebycontour.com. And between the two of them, you can get hold of me one way or another following see what we’re up to.